Requests for Comment/Miraheze official QQ groups or channel

As one of the world's best known wiki farms, Miraheze also has a large number of visitors from mainland China, but they have a problem in that they cannot register an account and wiki creators cannot use Discord or IRC with recaptcha as a captcha to communicate with Miraheze officials, which greatly hinders the development of Miraheze in mainland China. So I suggest that Miraheze could set up an official (or semi-official) channel or a number of official (or semi-official) group chats on QQ, which would greatly help mainland Chinese visitors to participate in Miraheze. 城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 13:41, 27 March 2022 (UTC)

Proposal 1: PROPOSAL NAME HERE
PROPOSAL CONTENT HERE 城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 13:41, 27 March 2022 (UTC)

Support

 * 1)  as proposer. 城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 13:41, 27 March 2022 (UTC)
 * 2)  Seems like a good way to enable more people to use Miraheze Bugambilia (talk) 15:31, 27 March 2022 (UTC)
 * 3)  For the same reason.滑稽金苹果 (talk)

Abstain/Neutral

 * 1) I must respectively disagree with Agent Isai's non-verified claim that Tencent is more of a privacy risk than, say, Facebook or even Discord, or that it logs any more information than the former two. Thus, there's not really a compelling reason to oppose, but my main reason why I can't support, either, is that another platform would require additional volunteer time commitment to monitor and support, and I wouldn't want to see only one volunteer monitoring the QQ Miraheze platform. That would be a lot of pressure for that volunteer. I believe, however, these concerns are valid, but there are other options. For example, we could look at adapting or adding MirahezeMagic global interface messages that instruct users who are unable to register to e-mail the applicable team(s) in order to complete a request form. We could look at not applying no open proxies policy to IRC channels, as it's never had a community discussion to implement. It has just been accepted by Stewards, together with their SRE colleagues, who moderate and administer that platform, based upon a reasonable request from the MirahezeBots team. We could look at some other option, too. Dmehus (talk) 18:50, 27 March 2022 (UTC)
 * According to the Constitution of the People's Republic of China, unless criminal cases are involved, no state organ has the right to investigate individuals' chat records and other private information, and as long as Tencent's payment services are not used, then the only personal information recorded is the phone number, which was leaked out by Facebook long ago--城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 00:40, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Fandom also has an official QQ group, and there are quite a few of them --城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 00:49, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * That's true, and as I said, my concern isn't really QQ being a privacy risk. Would I use it? Probably yes, if I had a compelling need to use it. My main reason precluding me from supporting this request is who would "staff" the channel? Even if we get one Miraheze community volunteer, I don't think it's fair to ask one community volunteer to be that sole representative in the Miraheze QQ channel. Perhaps you could create an unofficial Miraheze QQ channel with fellow Chinese users, and forward account creation requests or IRC IP block exemption requests to  every few days or even once a week? Dmehus (talk) 00:54, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Efficiency is too low, far below normal, and people tend to trust officials more.城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 01:27, 28 March 2022 (UTC)

Oppose
I strongly oppose against this group. Although I am a Chinese speaker, I could always help and lack of Chinese speaking volunteer or the privacy risk. It is because that QQ actually labelled Malaysia population of 32.7 Million and most of Southeast Asia country (except Singapore and Brunei which all total around 649103066 people) as "Spam" and "Unsafe". Although Southeast Asia country might be poor and there might be some spammer, hacker and bot, it is no reason to block everyone in the region off it platform. (Also bot and hacker from Russia and China is more then us) It is not fair for us. Also by blocking, you also blocked most Chinese and English speaker off it's platform. If it only allow "rich" and "first world country" in, then I strongly don't recommended Miraheze have one on QQ. Miraheze is for everyone and could be used by anyone.

Due to blocking most of the population of Southeast Asia with 3 largest Chinese speaking group (Malaysia, Indonesia is blocked but Singapore aren't), there are very less Chinese speaking volunteer could help out with the QQ group. Jst Tan

Comments

 * 1) I'm not exactly comfortable with this, yet. An official Miraheze group would require that trusted users patrol the chat and we lack trusted users in the Chinese language which would make it difficult to monitor the chat to ensure the Code of Conduct is being upheld. Now, if we had moderators outside of China try to moderate the chat, a real privacy concern could potentially exist. Tencent doesn't exactly have the best reputation in privacy and logs an excessive amount of information from it's users in the form of cookies. I personally wouldn't feel comfortable with it installed on my device and I feel others outside of China may not either. Just my two cents but I don't particularly support this, primarily due to the first point.  Agent Isai  Talk to me! 15:44, 27 March 2022 (UTC)
 * See above for my answer to Dmehus' query, as long as you don't use the game and payment business, then Tencent only has your phone number and not your passport number or address, and your phone number has long been leaked by Facebook, you can find Chinese speaking users from Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia or even the world, and I know several of them who have activities in Miraheze Chinese Wikipedians. Then again you should not have any of your phones using Tencent SDK (as this is not commonly used in Europe and the US).--城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 00:47, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * See my proposed alternative solution of an unofficial Miraheze QQ channel maintained by you and fellow Chinese users. That may just well work. Dmehus (talk) 00:55, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * QQ is available in English, and as far as I know User:開拓者 will be in Chinese.If the email is unofficial and then forwarded, the workload will increase and applicants will have to wait longer due to the time difference, up to two days if forwarding is done daily.--城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 01:32, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Well, either way, they could well be waiting a couple days, whether it's an official group or not. As an official group with potentially only Chinese speaking volunteer, the backlog will likely be even longer than with the unofficial group you and your cohort maintain and translate and forward to Stewards and Global Sysops to action. Dmehus (talk) 01:55, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * How about a semi-official one?--城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 02:01, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Due to my personal problems at the moment, if it was completely unofficial then it would take longer, so at least someone from Miraheze would be needed to manage the account build on my behalf--城市酸儒文人挖坑 (talk) 02:05, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * My main concern is not privacy but rather the fact that we lack trusted volunteers who speak Chinese. That would be a deterrent for now for a support from my part for an official QQ group until we have a few trusted volunteers who can speak Chinese at a conversational level and who can keep an eye on the group. Agent Isai  Talk to me! 01:37, 28 March 2022 (UTC)
 * I going to dismiss theory, China gov could ask for user information without court request. China companies are required to give user important information at a moment notice. , yes, there a high Chinese speaking population in Malaysia but there won't be any that could be in QQ group if it blocked Malaysian phone number (I tested both time sometimes ago on mobile) for signing up. Miraheze is for everyone and could be used by anyone. Jst Tan